Cult of the Lamb: Fireside chat with Aussie game director Julian Wilton

With the PAX gaming convention approaching and Mr Wilton set to deliver a keynote address at the event, journalist Cai Holroyd spoke to Mr Wilton about game development, the future of Australia's industry and a very special wedding coming up.

CH: Cult of the Lamb is a massive hit with clear staying power, how do you respond to that kind of success? Does it change how you approach things?

JW: It does change how you approach things; when you're making a game that no one but the dev team has seen before, you make design decisions based on what you think players will want and how it might make them feel.

But once the game has been released, you know what the players want and what they felt, and meeting and exceeding their expectations becomes a part of the development process.

It's still pretty crazy to see how many people love the game - the fanart, cosplays, tattoos and more! We're so grateful every time someone tells us how much the game means to them.

CH: For the game's anniversary, you partnered with Klei's Don't Starve and introduced Webber as a guest cultist. Are there other collaborations you'd like to do? Are we likely to see other guest cultists?

JW: There are so many games we love that would be a dream to collaborate with - they're as much fun for us to make as for players to play. Are you likely to see more guest cultists? ...Who knows!

CH: You've been putting out updates consistently - is there a planned end to those updates?

JW: We've been able to do three free major content updates - plus the Don't Starve Crossover - since the game was released in 2022 purely because of how much love and support the game has received. It wouldn't have been possible otherwise!

We want this game to be the best it can possibly be, so we'll keep putting out updates until we feel like we're there.

CH: What would the Lamb's Smash Bros Ultimate be?

JW: It would be the Lamb with their Crown turning into any weapon they want, and their special moves all being poop related.

Mr Wilton is set to deliver a keynote address at PAX Australia this year, but that's not all that Massive Monster will be hosting this year. The studio is set to preside over two marriages in cult-themed weddings over the weekend.

CH: What are you going to be talking about at PAX Storytime?

JW: Great question! I'm more of a 'leave it to the last minute' man, so I think we can all find out together. Last talk I did was at G-Con, a game developer conference in Busan, I had lots of jokes in there, but no laughter. Perhaps a translation issue, perhaps a me issue, so I look forward to finding out at the keynote.

Some general scribbles of notes are more of a focus on anecdotes over trying to pretend like I know what I'm doing. Exploring how I got into games, business & creative direction.

CH: What do you hope people take away from your talk?

JW: Hopefully not being bored for an hour, that's all I can hope for.

CH: Massive Monster is marrying two couples at PAX this year. Were you surprised when people took you guys up on the offer? What will the ceremony look like?

JW: We had no idea! We received hundreds of applications from all over the world, so it took a little while to narrow it down to just two. We're thrilled with the couples we selected - thank the gods they're crazy enough to go through with it!

Our booth is the most ambitious one we've ever done, standing at eight metres tall. We've poured so much time and effort into making it something truly special, not just for the couples but for everyone who visits.

As for the ceremonies themselves, you'll have to come see for yourself! But if I had to sum it up in a few words: Priestess, furries, and praising the Lamb.

It's not all wedding bells and rituals in game development though, and the industry has suffered in recent years with thousands of developers laid off from studios around the world - and the ever-persistent problem of crunch asking developers to work harmful amounts of overtime in order to hit deadlines.

CH: Do you think crunch in the games industry is as big a problem in Australia as it is elsewhere? What can be done about it?

JW: Crunch is a persistent problem in the games industry, not helped by the age of remote work thinning the line between work and personal time. Because of how complex it is to make a game, they need to hit tightly scheduled milestones, and because of how deeply interconnected each aspect of game development is, a holdup in one department can cause workflow issues throughout the studio. Add to that job scarcity and insecurity, fickle funding and lack of a strong union presence throughout the industry, crunch just keeps crunching.

While it's easy to say "plan well to avoid crunch!" the truth is that even the best-made plans go astray, especially in games where you can't even fathom all the problems you might encounter. A more sustainable method would include studios not only setting limits on overtime, but creating a culture that strongly encourages disconnecting from the workplace so that unpaid overtime doesn't creep in.

On a larger level, this is also creating and abiding by labour laws that protect the time off of employees such as the recent Right to Disconnect laws, and joining a union to promote and protect those rights. And re-shaping the culture, not just in game dev but also for players, publishers, anyone who interacts with the industry, to one that prioritises the wellbeing of the people who make the game, not just the game itself.

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CH: What, if anything, can be done about the mass layoffs hitting the games industry? How do you see it recovering?

JW: It's definitely been a very difficult time for the games industry with the absolutely insane amount of layoffs and shutdowns. Unfortunately, this probably means that we've lost a generation of amazing game developers who need to find more stable work in other industries, and it doesn't bode well for students and young people who are interested in studying games but can't see a future for themselves.

We're lucky in Australia that our government bodies are releasing more and more games funding each year to support the amazing game devs that we have here. And at recent conferences and conventions, places have been held in programs, events, talks etc. specifically for devs who have been affected by the layoffs in a great act of support and community building.

The industry will recover inevitably, but whether or not it will be better or worse off is yet to be seen. The games industry is unique in the way it works internally and the niche it fills in the larger economy, and ideally the people making decisions that affect that industry will have an understanding of that.

CH: How can we better support game development in Australia?

JW: While the Australian industry has felt the impact of the recent shutdowns and layoffs, government funding and pathway programs are increasing each year - Massive Monster as a company and a few of our employees as individuals have benefited directly from these opportunities.

I (Julian) have grand plans at the mercy of Creative Victoria funding for some. We're looking at Investment, Co-Working, Incubation etc. We're hoping to be a company that can help elevate Australia's game development even further.